Is this site dying?

[Syko]

I've been around here on and off since JKHub opened in 2012. I can't help but notice that lately it seems like there are less and less people making mods and forum posts. Is this just me or is this something other people have noticed? It seems strange to me that now is the time that the site would start to die off. JKHub opened 9 years after Jedi Academy came out. You'd think there would be a lot more activity considering now Star Wars movies are coming out nearly every year. 

I wonder why the last two or three years has resulted in the biggest drop of activity. My guess is that a lot of the original base of people who made mods have just grown older and moved on. It's a shame that there aren't enough younger people around to breathe some life into the site. I guess I can understand why though. JKA is like 15 years old now and it was always a niche game to begin with.

[Jeff]

I think the overall interest in SW is dying from the Disney takeover and it's trickling down into every other area. 

[Noodle]

The site might indeed be dying, but the community does seem to keep on going. If anything, the great change I've noticed is that everybody seems to have abandoned forums and moved on to discord. 

[Circa]

Activity has shifted heavily from here to the Jedi Knight Discord. It's a lot more active over there. With that said, the community has been dying since 2003, so this can't be a surprise to anyone. It fluctuates here and there (like when JKHub launched, when TFA came out, etc.) but it's always been dying a slow death.

 

What Jeff said isn't true at all. If anything, interest in Star Wars is higher than it's ever been worldwide. Just because some older fans are still bitter about Disney buying Lucasfilm, doesn't mean everyone feels that way. Just looking at how huge Star Wars Celebration was this year was a refreshing look at how big the fandom has gotten, even with the new films.

 

But Jedi Academy is an old game. It's fun to mod but it's still old. Multiplayer is very hard to get into for new people because of the saber combat's nuances (hard to go against the veterans who have been playing since day 1, that still play). Interest is hard to keep when there are tons of amazing games coming out to give our attention to. Just how it goes. People come and go. I've left JKA to focus on other things a few times now. Right now I stay informed and obviously help here as staff, but as far as playing or modding, I am in hiatus at the moment.

 

I will add that I recently started and disbanded a clan from 2016 to 2018, partially to see if starting a clan in JKA MP base was still possible. It definitely was, we were very successful and it was great. But the way people play games isn't like it used to be in 2003, and there are so many of them now that its hard to dedicate time to an old game when there are tons of others that you want to play. Plus, running a clan, or even participating in one, can consume so much of your time that it becomes a chore. Same could be said for modding, if you're part of a big mod project.

 

tl;dr - It's always been a dying community, new movies have actually helped - not hindered, people come and go. Such is the way of life.

[Jeff]

Activity has shifted heavily from here to the Jedi Knight Discord. It's a lot more active over there. With that said, the community has been dying since 2003, so this can't be a surprise to anyone. It fluctuates here and there (like when JKHub launched, when TFA came out, etc.) but it's always been dying a slow death.

 

What Jeff said isn't true at all. If anything, interest in Star Wars is higher than it's ever been worldwide. Just because some older fans are still bitter about Disney buying Lucasfilm, doesn't mean everyone feels that way. Just looking at how huge Star Wars Celebration was this year was a refreshing look at how big the fandom has gotten, even with the new films.

 

But Jedi Academy is an old game. It's fun to mod but it's still old. Multiplayer is very hard to get into for new people because of the saber combat's nuances (hard to go against the veterans who have been playing since day 1, that still play). Interest is hard to keep when there are tons of amazing games coming out to give our attention to. Just how it goes. People come and go. I've left JKA to focus on other things a few times now. Right now I stay informed and obviously help here as staff, but as far as playing or modding, I am in hiatus at the moment.

 

I will add that I recently started and disbanded a clan from 2016 to 2018, partially to see if starting a clan in JKA MP base was still possible. It definitely was, we were very successful and it was great. But the way people play games isn't like it used to be in 2003, and there are so many of them now that its hard to dedicate time to an old game when there are tons of others that you want to play. Plus, running a clan, or even participating in one, can consume so much of your time that it becomes a chore. Same could be said for modding, if you're part of a big mod project.

 

tl;dr - It's always been a dying community, new movies have actually helped - not hindered, people come and go. Such is the way of life.

 

Are you honestly saying Disney hasn't destroyed the passion for Sw? There's a new Star Wars movie coming out in December yet the buzz around this film is not there. No one is talking about it or even speculating about this trilogy which is a clear sign no one cares. 

[Circa]

Are you honestly saying Disney hasn't destroyed the passion for Sw? There's a new Star Wars movie coming out in December yet the buzz around this film is not there. No one is talking about it or even speculating about this trilogy which is a clear sign no one cares. 

 

I'm absolutely saying that. Just because it's not happening in your circle doesn't mean it's not happening. This exact same situation happened with the prequels. If this game came out in 2016, kids would be making mods left and right for these new movies. Passion is still alive and well. Like I said, look at Star Wars Celebration videos and you'll see passion is greater than ever. The various Star Wars subreddits are alive with Episode 9 buzz. The new trailer dropped and reddit (and all of social media for that matter) was going insane.

 

You don't have to love the new films to still like Star Wars. It's possible you don't see the hype on the internet because you have chosen to ignore it, since you're not a fan of the new films anyway. No idea. But saying there is 0 hype is just plain ignorant. I'm actually kind of baffled someone would even say that. You must live in a pretty closed off circle to say that.

 

And honestly, hype for the new films isn't shown on here because it's absolutely horrendous trying to talk to most of you about them. Some people are not fans of them, so y'all have to ruin discussions about them by complaining. I gave up, so I stay away from the Star Wars Franchise Discussion forum and any sequel discussion here on JKHub now. Which is partly why activity has gotten pretty low around here, I assume. I know a lot of people have done the same.

[Noodle]

Are you honestly saying Disney hasn't destroyed the passion for Sw? There's a new Star Wars movie coming out in December yet the buzz around this film is not there. No one is talking about it or even speculating about this trilogy which is a clear sign no one cares. 

 

Could it be that you're projecting your own feelings unto the rest, nobody can argue that Disney has destroyed your passion for Star Wars, but that doesn't mean it's been the general rule. 

 

I think Circa might be right when he states that perhaps the reason why you think there's zero buzz about the film is because the circles that you frequent have no hype for it and also because the way the Internet works now must reinforce this feeling in you (if you watched 1 anti-TLJ video, you'll be swarmed by videos with the same content thanks to Youtube's algorithm and hence you'll be led to think that's the way the majority thinks, when in reality it's the web feeding you the content it thinks you'll like). 

 

The way I see it, there's a generation gap that has been created by the new movies, the same way it happened with the prequels and the beginning of TCW, maybe we aren't the target audience of the new movies, but that doesn't retroactively destroy the things we used to like. Personally, I don't care about the new movies that much, but I've been enjoying the new stuff that has come in anthology films, videogames and comics, so I can't complain much! 

[Jeff]

Where was all this passion with Solo? It lost money. Take a look at toys and merchandise sales they're plummeting. The Last Jedi actively destroyed Luke Skywalker and divided the fan base and you think that has no effect. It's great if you enjoy the new stuff but to fool yourself into believing everything is fine here is foolish. Also my love of Star Wars hasn't changed an ounce I just expect great content are we are not getting it.

[Futuza]

I think mostly what your seeing is just a migration of people to the Discord.  That's plenty of active, forums not so much.

[Circa]

Where was all this passion with Solo? It lost money. Take a look at toys and merchandise sales they're plummeting. The Last Jedi actively destroyed Luke Skywalker and divided the fan base and you think that has no effect. It's great if you enjoy the new stuff but to fool yourself into believing everything is fine here is foolish. Also my love of Star Wars hasn't changed an ounce I just expect great content are we are not getting it.

 

That's all just subjective. You say they destroyed Luke Skywalker, but I disagree. I actually love what they did with Luke, and so do tons of other fans. Just because you don't and your friends don't doesn't mean that's the only opinion. Like you said, it divided the fan base. Just like the prequels divided the fan base back in early 2000's (and is still divided, by the way).

 

Passion with Solo lacked from the casual Star Wars fans because a Star Wars movie just came out a few months earlier. Sure, some fans didn't like The Last Jedi and they decided to boycott Solo. But the majority of people just didn't even know about Solo. Majority of casual fans I know would see the trailer on TV and just assume it was the one that came out in December. I definitely blame Disney for that decision; they should have waited to release Solo later.

 

And yeah, everything is fine. Fandom being split in opinions is the trademark of Star Wars fandom since Empire Strikes Back came out. It's not new, and it's not going to destroy Star Wars. You don't like something, avoid it and move on, because there are people that do. Let people enjoy things.

 

If your passion for Star Wars hasn't changed, stop trying to change it for others.

 

Anyway, this is getting off topic.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------

 

I feel I need to mention @@Syko that a lot of cool work is being done in the forum itself, not necessarily being released in the file section. Part of that is because they are dealing with some ported content that they can't release on our files area, and part of it is because it's just not finished yet. Still lots of cool stuff you look into.

 

And if you haven't made a Discord account yet, check it out and join the JKCommunity server: https://discord.gg/gFKwH85

[Plasma]

Could it be that you're projecting your own feelings unto the rest, nobody can argue that Disney has destroyed your passion for Star Wars, but that doesn't mean it's been the general rule. 

Agreed, I wouldn't have made anything for JA in the past few years if the new movies hadn't come along.

[TheWhitePhoenix]

Agreed, I wouldn't have made anything for JA in the past few years if the new movies hadn't come along.

 

A rarity that you post, Plasma. But excuse me for diverging from the main topic to at least ask you a question: Any plans on improving your Kylo Ren model for the future?

[NumberWan]

I can remember one such "dying" of a Russian JK community back in 2000s, and the worst thing was that since then I've lost contact with most of the Star Wars fans of that era. Thankfully some of them managed to find me and it's possible to communicate with them via Social Media and emails. But I'm glad we have JKHub, which sometimes boosts the interest of the people in JK again.

[Aldro Koon]

Can confirm we discuss the movies on our community forums and this notion that the new sequel movies killed SW is not true at all in my experience (yes some are unhappy but others like myself are thrilled).
We're also getting ~30 applications every month with daily activity of ~20+ players at peaktime.

I'd argue that the majority of those who come to Jedi Academy are probably ending up in clans like ours rather than coming here.
In my experience, most players have an expiration date until they move on (very few actually remain active and around).
Thus unless you actively seek new people -- Eventually you're bound to notice major inactivity.

 

But this is a community hub and not a clan so obviously the incentive to be active/post might is not the same.
That doesn't mean that there aren't people still here and lurking. The modding section is what makes these forums awesome for me atleast.

[Archangel35757]

IMO... I think folks use the Discord channel for more real-time help, chat, etc. JKHub serves a purpose for project updates, etc.

[Tompa9]

As I see it, most of the modders turned into groups and are working on bigger mods like Movie Battles, Movie Duels, KOTF, Dark Forces II or are busy with making own single mods. Also most of the models/maps were already made and new models are rather ported than made from scratch. But sometimes something interesting pop ups in the files. I think this is natural evolution instead of dying community.

[Sentra]

@@Circa Thanks for heads-up with Discord 

[Wolfeye]

(I'm running a little behind on forum reading so excuse my 13-day behindness and necrotic powers on this topic )

I'm surprised no one has mentioned this yet, but we have evidence, at least since the first movie, of JKA activity increasing as a result of the movie releases. I can't say for sure for the others, as I haven't seen any statistic data, but we actually have a post here on the Hub back from the Episode 7 release when Caelum went crazy with statistics.

https://jkhub.org/page/index.html/_/sitenews/happy-new-year-r135

I would love to see an updated version of this actually for recent years, because I get the feeling the trend has continued to a lesser degree even from the most recent movie releases. Thing is, whether or not people like the SW content being released, it reminds them of the nostalgic old content (and it also causes SW activity to be more prominent--such as in the form of steam sales--which raises awareness for the game). Just as well, not to parrot others, but JKC has taken a LOT of the activity since Discord is just a more modern, better platform for communicating than forums. We still receive relatively regular mod submissions here, and there are plenty in-development which is pretty surprising honestly. Which reminds me, I may have to go check on the growing quantity of submissions in our queue right now that I've been neglecting duty on, heh.   

tl;dr: circa is about right

(Yes, the circa/about pun was intended. I know it's bad, leave me alone, it's 1:00am for me)

[Onysfx]

Definitely everyone moving to discord, it's just so convenient. I myself agree the community has been heavily divided from TLJ, not just because of what they did to luke, but because SJW politics have been inserted into star wars, and it's drawn out the true colors in each of us, thus dividing the community, far more so than the prequels ever did IMO.

[Smoo]

I sometimes read through all new posts each day, there is still quite alot of activity on here considering how old the games are

[Tompa9]

Yeah, most of the people are discussing on discord on regural daily basis because it is better platform for that. But Discord still cant replace jkhub because there is where all modders upload their public files. Discord isnt suited for anything above 7MB . Im not worried this website will die, people are just more discussing on discord and using jkhub for upload. Natural evolution.

[ChalklYne]

The site isn't dead, it's haunted.

[Onysfx]

I still come here from time to time, I'm sad discord is taking over, just like I'm sad blockbuster is dead cause of streaming, and retail is dying cause of amazon. Although they are far more convenient, I'm concerned that monopolies and human laziness will be our undoing.

[Xioth]

This site in particular? Yes.

 

Activity in forums and mods have been decreased dramatically.

 

Hell the request board is probably all but useless now because we either have people that see it, wanna do it but don't have the time or don't have enough interest in it to do it.

 

OR

 

Assholes who say "do it yourself" which is counterproductive when something's asked in the request board. I feel we should have that phrase banned from being used in the request board.

 

Aside from that, people who used to regularly release stuff have left or shown less effort in their releases, yeah its cool we got em but people just kinda release em and nope out.

 

There is almost 0 people regularly releasing things. You'd come back once a week 2 years ago and there'd be at least 3-4 new mods every week.

 

If you want me to be honest, I think its mainly the hostility of the community, aside from being competitive, which there's nothing wrong with, we can be er... pretty hostile to newcomers, alarmingly so. I saw some guy get chewed out because he didn't know how to install a mod or use blender, something along the lines of "It's not that hard, you can figure it out." when we should be calm, cool, collective, and nice, super SUPER nice to newcomers, show them this is a good place to be.

 

What I'm saying is, yes, I feel you do need to baby newcomers to an extent, if they need help you help them but don't go out of your way to be condescending towards em. Make them feel like they're important to the community even if they're brand new.

 

This isn't towards anyone in particular, this is towards practically everyone, me, you, everyone, lol.

 

The hostility towards ports I feel is also a BIIIIT unjustified because it's the majority of people's starting points, we can't expect people to know what to do in Blender even with the extensive tutorials we do have.

 

Also... We need more areas not revolving around Jedi Academy. Not mod-wise but forum-wise. Example, why can't I find anywhere to go talk about other games like Skyrim, Oblivion, GTA V, the Battlefront games, new and old. If we already have that then it really needs to be labeled more clearly because in all my time I haven't been able to find it.

[ChalklYne]

The scorning came from requester pestering, passing off works as their own, having an entitled demeanor while requesting, impatience for modders, and comparing original work to a game studios work and requesting we just port the models as opposed to trying on our own. No one just woke up one day and decided to be jerks to the requesting community, there was just a complete disconnect between requesters and modders, and it drove a lot of modders away, hence asking some requesters to learn the ropes for themselves on the simpler stuff. The jkhub community is in its current state because of all parties involved, not just the modders.

 

The hostility towards ports at least personally stems from a few problems... the awesome talent that we have here being asked to just stop trying and port the original models, even though 1. The original models are built for much higher end engines and will cause issues if ported, and 2. It takes the fun out of it and turns modders from hobbyists to employees. Ports hurt a modeler because when one modeler spends months or years developing a model, then you just port over Lucas arts model next to it with 50,000 more polygons, you tend to be quite cruel with comparison. Not taking into account the need to drastically drop resolution for engine stability and just judging someone's 6 months of work vs a team of trained professionals and digital scans and limitless engine capabilities 4 years of work like they're somehow comparable. Also, a lot of requests just kinda stink and I think personally that I have to have some sort of interest in the model to work on it.

 

This is jkhub... for jedi knight games... skyrim, gta etc have their own sites, modders, community, and discords.

 

So it seems u and I have opposing ideology on what makes jkhub great and where it could improve. Maybe the utopia of jkhub u envision is the opposite of what I'd like to see. Therein lies the conflict of websites in general. Can't please everyone. I'll agree with you that this site seems to have lost traffic, but I do believe we have conflicting opinions as to why or how to remedy it

 

I'll further add to my point that it seems the elders are showing less and less productivity because of real life and how that goes when you no longer have 18 hours a day to work on jk stuff... and the newcomers we asked to learn as well as request didn't and now there's no next generation of modders.
Just a theory though
And also.... yeah... discord.
95% of my models now are for sale on various sites, but I still have all my old models and will work on them from time to time. I still have the passion for it, just also gotta pay bills raise kids spend time with the wife... I wish there was a younger person with the passion I have and time I lack.
Triple post combo, r.i.p. bergen

Edited July 12, 2019 by Circa
Merged triple post. No Bergen here.