Cerez

But we are talking of a ideal world that is controlled by the Jedi, where the Dark Side, wild emotions, ambition, and temptations are no more. Where chaos is non-existant, and beings are in harmony with one another and at peace with the world, serene. The Jedi ideology is not an ideology solely to fight the Dark Side. It spans much further than that. It is to protect the universe's state at peace. As old Obi-Wan put it in his own words: "For over a thousand generations the Jedi were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic, before the dark times, before the emperor happened..." (Notice how he refers to the current state, in which the Empire rules, and there is law and order throughout most of the galaxy, as the "dark times" -- a striking contrast to the truth for most civilians of that time.) In a world where there was no Dark Side to fight, the Jedi would attempt to right the wrongs elsewhere, and maintain peace and justice. Peace and justice from whose point of view? Their own. Which brings me to @@Mizore's argument: While this is true while that goal is unattainable, Jedi are people, too, and if given the chance, through generations, they would aspire to inspire others to follow their ways to a degree, so that what they perceive to be the balance and harmony of the universe would persist. Don't forget that as well as being protectors of the undermined, they are guardians of their beliefs first and foremost. As mentioned in my argument above, in a galaxy where there are no Dark Side temptations prevalent, the Jedi would aspire to end *all* conflict, and have the world at peace with itself. This is hardly in the complete interest of humanity -- it is only one part of our existence. This is where I believe the Dark Side plays a beneficial role in the Star Wars universe, at the other extreme, to balance the Light.

Luke's Jedi Academy was different in that it allowed for human error, it's true. Because of this it was more dynamic, as well. I don't know if we can say that the flaws were polished, but I would say that the New Jedi Order stood closer to Gray Jedi ideologies in that many of its Jedi basked in both sides of the Force, but ultimately chose to stay at a neutral ground. It wasn't closely following the traditional Jedi ways.

The Jedi can co-exist with everyone else. That doesn't tip the scale of the balance. The extreme scenario would be if the Jedi had started either enforcing or inspiring others into following their own Code. If you look at the Jedi Code, one thing becomes glaringly obvious: there is no room for human error, or even essential human traits, and such "trangressions" are rarely tolerated, if at all, in the Order. "There is no emotion" they say. But people truly live when they feel."There is no ignorance" they say, yet what would you say is the most defining characteristic of human society? It's simplification, categorisation, and ignorance."There is no passion" they say, yet what are we taught we need to follow in order to be our best? A life without passion would hardly get us anywhere, and a life without love would be a life wasted."There is no chaos" they say, ignorant of the fact that chaos is an essential contrast to harmony, and that nature thrives in both."There is no Death" they say, yet death is an inseparable part of the human condition that gives our lives meaning. We cannot cheat death. Even if our spirits do live on, we are not what we once were -- it is a permanent transformation.In other words, to live like a Jedi, and live it truly, would mean to not be human. A society inspired by such ideals would stagnate, become stale and lifeless. In such an idealistic society bliss would become a chore because there would be no hard times to compare it to. Peace, and its meaning would ultimately be forgotten. People would lose all ambition, and exist only to exist with the world -- effectively becoming lifeless. The human spirit would die.

Tell me, why I should care about Jyn, and what happens to her in the movie? What makes me care about her story (i.e. the majority of the movie)? Precisely, I agree with you. That may have helped us bond with Jyn more, and actually relate to her on an emotional level. Yep, they have a reason alright: couldn't be bothered; there's no money in it... (i.e. "We know how to make money, not quality films. Don't hit us with this bullsh*t, just go buy a ticket to see the film already! We've given you enough marketing and fan-service.")

Which he learned from hunting, growing up, as one of the only forms of entertainment, and a skill for survival in the harsh deserts of Tatooine... And he wasn't that good...

When she was 17...? Wow... she must have had some combat experience... And that's why he left her, because she was the best...? Sure, that makes total sense... >.<'

One question: Can someone explain to me who Jyn Erso actually is, and where her dazzling fighting skills come from? Quoting the movie, please, not Wookiepedia. Because I didn't catch that... Or who any of the crew of Rogue One really are, for that matter. I know who Kyle Katarn and Jan Ors are. I don't know these guys. (And yes, I've seen the film...

Yet in all their wisdom they could not foresee that fighting for one side to end a conflict is not a position they should put themselves under, or that a boy who has lost everything needs love above all to grow up balanced, and strengthen his character. It seems to me the Jedi took their ideologies a little too to the point and literally. They became extrmists on the other side in the face of pressure.

Can they? I question that. People generally don't seem to notice when something they're used to is around. Only when it is gone do they pay attention to it. While I cannot (and do not want to) deny this, I will draw attention to the fact that without a dynamic between opposing powers, it is generally observed, in human behaviour, that things will go stale, progress will be halted, people will go lazy. It seems to me humanity needs conflict, and if the Jedi Code is to be followed to the fullest, there would be no room for any conflict at all. It seems to me that the Jedi are the other extreme.

I will. Why hurt the makers of that which you love?

Is there a way (console setting) to disable the zoom effect when the "speed" Force power is used in SP? I hate that visual effect -- it distorts the view and just gets in the way of things. Any way to turn it off permanently? Does anyone know? And while we're at it, any way to turn off the Force Speed trail?

Well, who says you can't? Actually, that would be illegal, I think. Is Robot Chicken available for free streaming online (officially)? I'm not sure... (Some TV series are...)

Whoah, Afinity... did I mention I love you?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPria4lrLRc

Damn seagulls, stop it now!

Yes, I would see both of those scenarios as extreme and out of balance. In the first case, if the Jedi have created total peace, harmony, and understanding in the galaxy, progress would be halted to a stand-still and an entire civilisation would fall into apathy and decay. So, in other words, too much good is not good. The second scenario is easier to answer -- a war-torn galaxy where suffering is prevalent is once again out of balance, so in that scenario Gray Jedi would work to help the Light Side rise. In other words, too much conflict leads to too much suffering, and a tip in the natural balance once again. A true Gray Jedi would therefore -- in my understanding -- appreciate conflict as long as it ultimately serves a better purpose, and helps keep the balance between the Light and the Dark. So yes, sometimes that means looking the other way, and letting the Dark Side do its work. Not partaking in the atrocities necessarily, as Dark Jedi would, but supporting/helping it nonetheless. (Or just going along for the ride as a spectator.) They are the neutral party between the Light and the Dark, an outcast to both. They were once Jedi of the Order, now they walk the independent and uncertain road between the Dark and the Light. Conflict may be the bringer of much suffering, but is also a necessary part of the appreciation of harmony. The two are worthless without each other; they are unseparably connected. It depends on the state of balance in the Force. If there is too much harmony, conflict is needed. If there is too much conflict, more harmony is needed. Gray Jedi would appreciate and aid the work of the Dark Side in a galaxy dominated by the Light. Call it being bored. (But actually, it's working against the staleness and decay an all-Light galaxy would bring.) They would work to weaken the influence of the Jedi Order.