The future of JK and similar games

[Link]

I'm just curious, I have been reading some news reports over the past year that 32bit applications will be dropped some time this decade as newer Windows based operating systems will only support 64bit and 128bit applications.

 

If this happens and the majority of standard users upgrade to these operating systems, games like JK3 surely couldn't run without some form of 32bit emulator/virtual machine I'm assuming. Currently 16bit applications struggle to run on my machine since I'm on 64bit meaning I have to use DOSBox to run games like Carmageddon (<3) which isn't a straight forward process to a standard user.

 

I'm in no way an expert on this matter but judging by those currently hanging around JKHub I assume someone will have some insight into this and what (If anything) can be done to prepare older games for this?

[Astral Serpent]

Raz0r will fix this, he fixes everything. -Rocks back and forth with his GameData folder in arms- hefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthishefixeseverythingraz0rwillfixthis

[eezstreet]

I run a 64 bit OS and my 32 bit apps still work. Some apps don't work sure (like KotOR) but that's because their programmers usually don't follow proper conventions. Either way, there will always be workarounds (see: Sandboxie)

[Link]

I run a 64 bit OS and my 32 bit apps still work. Some apps don't work sure (like KotOR) but that's because their programmers usually don't follow proper conventions. Either way, there will always be workarounds (see: Sandboxie)

 

I know, I'm talking about when operating systems of the future that are 64/128 rather than 32/64 as they are now.

[MagSul]

It'll be a dark day when my PC refuses to run Jedi Academy. I have an emergancy stash of chocolate for just such an occassion.

[GingerbreadNinja]

I doubt it's going to be in the next decade... One big reason for switching over to the 64 bit architecture was that it can handle more memory addressing. 32-bit could only handle 4 gigabytes of RAM. I'm guessing it'll take us more than a decade to reach the 16 exabyte limit of 64 bit. That's 17,179,869,184 gigabytes... Good luck getting through that within one decade. No, your PC can't actually handle that much right now, but it is possible. While there might be some benefits of having 128-bit, the only things I could see using 128-bit processors is network equipment -- IPv6 is 128-bit, and many encryption algorithms use 128-bit keys -- since they might benefit from the 128-bit word size.

 

There are other reasons for switching from 32- to 64-bit but I don't think we'll need to worry about them for 128-bit for a long while. Maybe we'll get quantum computers in our homes first. =P

[Link]

Ah that's some good insight, thank you

[Raz0r]

32 bit applications run on W7 x64 because of WoW, essentially a translator for 32 bit code to 64 bit code (pointer and stack manipulation)

 

Luckily, our current generation 64 bit processors (read: x86_64) still support the "32 bit" x86 architecture, it just has 64 bit extensions.

Technically, they even run 16 bit code: AX vs EAX v RAX is 16 vs 32 vs 64 bit register access

 

If by some stupid move, this architecture is abandoned in consumer hardware, then we'll have far more problems to deal with than "JA isn't working and I upgraded my machine and refuse to run a virtual machine despite obviously having the hardware to do so comfortably"

Edited June 27, 2012 by Razish

[Drako]

From what i can gather, we have around 5-10 years left (ish).

 

Reason: Windows were reluctant to release 32bit Windows 7, and almost didint support 32bit Windows 8.... soooo, my guess is Windows 9 wont have 32bit (ignore the "this is the last Windows", they're too stupid to make a perfect OS, so there will be a new one)

 

But yeah, If Windows 9 doesnt support 32bit, the amount of JKA players will start to plummet on a by-monthly scale (where as currently the effects of the games age can only really be seen on a yearly scale, mostly due to its release on steam and unique game play).

 

Im hoping Windows will realise there dumbassery and release 32bit Windows 9

 

 

In other relevance, The amount of companies abandoning 32bit is on the increase (or atleast not including support on release).

[MagSul]

Im hoping Windows will realise there dumbassery

 

But I'm not hugely optimistic myself, but I do hope too.

[Saiaku]

But I'm not hugely optimistic myself, but I do hope too.

 

Duh.. they are americans

[GingerbreadNinja]

But yeah, If Windows 9 doesnt support 32bit, the amount of JKA players will start to plummet on a by-monthly scale (where as currently the effects of the games age can only really be seen on a yearly scale, mostly due to its release on steam and unique game play).

 

Are you trying to say they will not release a new 32-bit operating system? Because, I don't really see why they should be required to.

 

Or are you trying to say that there won't be a compatibility layer for 32-bit applications on their new 64-bit operating systems. Because, that would be silly of them. Especially since they came out compatibility mode for applications.

[afi]

JKA does work on 64-bit, doesn't it?

[Link]

It does, but it's a 32 bit application.

 

16bit doesn't work on a 32/64 bit operating system without some trouble sadly... the same would presumably be said about 64/128 bit OS's.

[GingerbreadNinja]

JKA does work on 64-bit, doesn't it?

 

JKA is a 32-bit application. It does work on 64-bit, through a compatibility/execution layer.

[Drako]

Are you trying to say they will not release a new 32-bit operating system?

 

Basically, After Windows 8, it is unlikely. They aint required to, but as Link said, a 32 bit game wont work on a 64/128 bit OS, which is the next logical step. So without an emulator or some form of compatibility patch/system/whatever we wont be able to play JKA, which would be sad

[GingerbreadNinja]

Basically, After Windows 8, it is unlikely. They aint required to, but as Link said, a 32 bit game wont work on a 64/128 bit OS, which is the next logical step. So without an emulator or some form of compatibility patch/system/whatever we wont be able to play JKA, which would be sad

 

No, the next logical step is just a plain 64-bit PC operating system. You've got plenty of time before we get to 128-bit. Your 32-bit applications will likely still run, even though the OS is exclusively 64-bit. Think of Windows Server 2008 r2. It's entirely 64-bit, yet 32-bit applications run fine through WoW64. And furthermore, to say/assume that they will abandon compatibility with 32-bit applications if/when they do get to 128-bit is merely speculation at this point.

[Link]

No, the next logical step is just a plain 64-bit PC operating system. You've got plenty of time before we get to 128-bit. Your 32-bit applications will likely still run, even though the OS is exclusively 64-bit. Think of Windows Server 2008 r2. It's entirely 64-bit, yet 32-bit applications run fine through WoW64. And furthermore, to say/assume that they will abandon compatibility with 32-bit applications if/when they do get to 128-bit is merely speculation at this point.

 

That's a good point, I didn't even consider that possibility.

[Yzmo]

There's no real reason for Microsoft to drop 32-bit compatibility any time soon. Just think about all the companies using legacy 32-bit stuff. They'd make themselves extremely unpopular while also loosing a lot of sales. I regret to say that I believe the JKA community and general interest in the game will die much earlier than the possibility to run it.

[eezstreet]

EXTREME BUMPS.

YAYA.

 

What a different world things were a year ago when we didn't have source...

[Pande]

Microsoft has actually be one of the best for compatability with their older software, I doubt they will make 32bit impossible to use on any of their operating systems to come.

[minilogoguy18]

Even if so people would just make patches, for old Win98 games like Rogue Squadron I found patches to get the 16bit installer to run on my 64bit OS.

[Futuza]

Dosbox isn't too hard to work anyway.  I'm sure we could get an emulator running if SOMEHOW 128bit becomes the only working OS system.