eezstreet

Fair enough. See my below post about how that differs from how this would have taken place. Things like that generally imply that the creation is open to the public for free use, without requiring a donation in order to take place. Now, what Tim on the other hand did, he accepted "donations" so that his mod would continue. And generally I think everyone agrees that what Tim did was wrong. At what point does someone who fulfills the OP's (of that thread's) request become someone like Tim? What makes someone like Tim different from someone like a modeller who makes a model for cash? Was it just the viruses or the content he stole that made his actions bad? What about Dan Mor? Was it the fact that he piped the Ukrainian JKA community into his site, or was it the content that he stole that made it bad? See, the reason I bring up thievery is because it's all become clear to me now. If you're releasing models on the GLM format for cash, the GLM format was engineered and made by Raven Software, how fair is it that they spend all this time creating all these formats and exporters when people are practically gyping them for doing so? In a sense, you're kinda stealing from Raven, which in my eyes makes modders who do things for cash no different from Tim. And it doesn't matter what the drug dealer's motivations are, or how many times that he's sold drugs is. The fact is, the person who sells the content is someone who's done that. A drug dealer is still a drug dealer if they've done it one time after all. If I give you a donation as a means of gratitude after giving me some weed, does that still make it illegal for that transaction to take place?

From what I've gathered, people have been echoing the same sentiment, "it's fine to pay for models". Which, I agree, it isn't a bad thing. But I do disagree with making mods for cash. Because at what point do you decide that you're no different from Tim and Dan Mor, people that have deliberately sold assets for money? I'm not discussing the obvious thievery involved there. But I guess the same thing can be said of drug dealers: At what point do you go from a incidental person who sells a bit of dope for cash, to a dope dealer?

I guess the main thing I'm asking here is, is it wrong to make a mod for cash? Or isn't it? I'm not asking about models specifically. I'm talking about mods. I guarantee you that if the guy doesn't have the time to learn how to model, he isn't going to have the time to learn how to get it ingame either, since you would need a program to do such a thing, and some experience in the program.

Fine. I'll ask a real question then. Can I pay you to make a mod? No, but I still disagree with the idea that people need to pay money in order to get models done. Why waste all that time making a model for a guy for a few bucks, when you can curb the things you talked about in this thread by making a tutorial? That way, the community can benefit, not just one or two people with a dollar in their pocket or a model in their base folder.

? So...you're agreeing with my sentiment then? I'm confused as to what your position is. Yes, clearly. Money makes the world go round, etc. Most carpenters make people pay after the work is done. Which is ironic, since modelers don't pay for materials like carpenters do. Besides, what will you have lost if you didn't get paid? If we're talking about a carpenter again here, you're talking about wood and time, as well as space in their shop, and if they want to get rid of the piece and recuperate any of their losses, they have to go through the time to get the thing sold. Heck, modellers in my mind gain something from making models, since at the very least that can be a portfolio piece. I'm talking about in a hypothetical situation, in the perfect storm, how things would play out. If I paid you to make a mod, not taking cost into effect, not taking the idea of "doing this for a living" into effect, in fact, would you make a mod for cash? Yes or no? What's ridiculous is charging people for mods.

Why won't it never occur? You don't know that it won't ever occur. I could offer a job where I pay you $600 for each model (just using that as a baseline) tomorrow, and you mean to tell me that you wouldn't feel any bit wrong about modelling for JKA for cash? And for the record, I'm referring to a full PK3 and everything, all packed up nice, rigged, tagged for the game, all the amenities there. Don't see why you're making this personal, but okay. Difference is that freelance artists make models for a living, they don't make mods. I find making mods for pay is fundamentally wrong. Nothing wrong with models. And the reason I think why modellers don't make the cash is because sometimes the cost of these models is outrageous if you ask me. Quadruple digits for a model that took a week isn't really worth it if you ask me.

What does "probably" mean though? Means you're considering making models for mods for cash? Or that you would be intrigued by doing it? Would you make models for cash if you had the skill to do it, the time to do it, and you made more money than your day job?

You seem to be avoiding my question: if you got paid at a rate, salary, hourly, whatever, for making models primarily for use in mods, in such a case that you were getting paid more than your day job, would you do it?

I want a blog.

Supposing you did. Would you do it?

Would you pay for art for use in mods, supposing that it had more money for you than your day job? It's less hours and more pay! More flexible hours, and more flexibility. Not to mention, you don't have to mention it on your taxes. Makes life easier, does it not? Besides, if you made mods for cash, why do boring stuff? Doesn't all have to be mods either. Can do some indy game freelance stuff too. Wouldn't you want to mod for cash?

Getting paid for models generally allows the behavior of the buyer to proliferate. People need to realize that this is wrong and it doesn't belong in a modding community. So yeah, I agree with what @ said. Paying for or accepting payment in this sort of environment is ethically wrong in all kinds of ways.

Artists make a living out of painting, sculpting or whatever. If you're getting paid to make something for a mod project, you're doing it wrong. Most mod communities frown upon those that make anything for cash. Not only does it unlevel the playing field, but it makes things morally questionable for no good reason. I'd hate to mod for cash. Money is a filthy invention. I know of very few modelled that charge what I consider "decent amounts". Triple digits for a low poly model is way too much in my opinion, especially if you're dealing with mods and not indies. I've never seen a model that I've liked go for under $100. I can't honestly understand the mindset of artists. It seems like you're all pretty much in agreement that people should be able to mod for cash. I for one find that completely unacceptable. If I were a modeler, I'd refuse to model for money because let's face it: if you're still hanging around this mod community and make models for your own enjoyment, why do you need money? You're modelling for experience, fun, to express your ideas. I can't speak on behalf of programmers here (@@spior, @@Astral Serpent, @@Didz, @, @@Xycaleth, @@ensiform, @@redsaurus, @@Scooper correct me if I'm wrong) but I don't see how something so rooted in the concept of creativity can be so money driven. What we should be focusing on, instead of paying people for models, is teaching them how to model. That way, we can have a more thriving community full of modelers and such, than having people become frustrated by the appearance of people being gifted or whatever. Think about it this way, >DT<, instead of getting money from a person, you could get one of the things which might be useful to you: - More help for MB3 - Someone who can help you work on your own projects - Feeling better about yourself Society these days tends to lean towards being narcissistic. Why should things be like that? We ought to impose a system of paying things forward...learning a subject in this community ought to entitle people to teach that same subject to two people. Knowledge is power, wealth and worldly goods are illusions of power. That's why I think that JKG is beginning to thrive more and more. A lot of the team has spent lengthy amounts of time learning the engine, and reverse engineering portions of it. The main contributing devs for the most part know the engine up and down. But I think that honestly every single person on this forum has the capabilities to do things which we have done, MB2 has done, JA++ has done, and so on. I've been in that boat before. I had to realias two or three times before settling on this name. I found the coding community to be extremely open, extremely enjoyable, and generally a lot nicer than the majority of other fields that I've worked with (I started with maps, and ended in code). But paying for models? And this request system of models that seems to be common? It's crap to be honest...people sign up on the site just to make a request. For what? Someone to say no? And then the process repeats? No. I'm ranting. I'm sorry. I'm just tired of the divide between modelers and coders and I'm sick of greed. It bears repeating: money is a filthy invention.

JKA and short films are two different beasts entirely. If you want to make models for cash, I have no problem with that. I support the art trade and I believe in the movement that art is making these days. However... I don't agree with selling anything for cash whenever a mod project is involved. I'm disappointed that people see the need to make money off of what I consider to be a hobby, when the most they're putting into it is software costs. Freelancing models is fine, but fact of the matter is that artists are overcharging for bloody models. I get really red in the face over stuff like this. Other mod communities feel the same way as I feel I'm sure. EDIT: oh, and you know, the LucasArts mod policy... http://jediknight3.filefront.com/info/LAModPolicy

Don't know why this was over here. Thought it was in the forums, but whatever. http://www.moddb.com/mods/jkgalaxies/tutorials/hosting-a-phase-1-server

For whatever reason, my thread in TerranGaming on this randomly disappeared. Anyway, the directions are fairly straightforward: 1. Install game using launcher on Homehosted Package (serverside package might be broken, see my note below if you want the slightly experimental way of fixing this and saving yourself a bit of bandwidth potentially). The game does NOT support Linux serverside! (simple lack of time/resources and unnecessary in the long run really to write *nix binaries) The serverside does NOT work on jamp.exe! (jampded.exe or jampdedmulti.exe ONLY! Aluigi jampded should be compatible) 2. Unzip the Glua .zip (something along the lines of jkg_svGlua.zip), so that there is a Glua folder in your JKG folder. 3. Change the filename of server.cfg to be something else, modify the contents, and run a .bat which execs that .cfg and runs jampded.exe with fs_game set to JKG. NOTE: there is an experimental fix which may result in the Serverside package working. I don't remember if the PK3 is protected or not. I think it's one of the few that isn't protected. If you go this route: 1. open JKG_SVResources.pk3 2. delete ext_data/MP folder

Turns out that the size discrepancies are the fact that they did all the cinematics ingame as FMVs in JK2, while they were actually rendered ingame in JA. One interesting thing to note though is that trip mines use a different shader than usual. The little blue bits on trip mines actually flash. JKG replicates this behavior quite well, which I assume was BlasTech's original idea. Do note though that I haven't actually been able to unpack the archives as they're protected with Doom 3 archive formatting. Just haven't figured out the exact hash to unlock the files and it isn't really worth it.

If all else fails, try a complete reinstall using the launcher. That should definitely fix it. If not, we're releasing a PTR version soon-ish. My xfire is the same as my username here.

No. You need code to change that unfortunately. I think JA+ has a cvar for it though.

Lack of information isn't what's frowned upon. Paying people for a model is.

What @@Stoiss said. Clean up your base folder, make sure you're running via launcher or .bat, etc. "Not a JPG" occurs when the binaries for the game aren't loaded properly, and the game fails to properly read from a protected PK3 (or use an encrypted BSP). Remove any JKG assets from your base folder (if any are there)

From what I've read from the SDK, that would involve assuming that the user knows how to use Softimage XSI. Obviously, this is not the case since Eclipse had to spend a long time asking for assistance rigging his Vincent Valentine model. And what did he give in return? A tutorial which detailed how to rig models using Softimage XSI. That makes me realize that two things are wrong with what you just posted: 1. The SDK obviously didn't do him any good. Don't get me wrong, Eclipse strikes me as fairly intelligent, intelligent and patient enough to make a Vincent Valentine model. Course..we don't have his tut on this site either. 2. People don't just do stuff in exchange for knowledge. It shouldn't be that people should texture a model in order to get knowledge. That makes a modding society fairly broken. Relating my own experiences here: I did not just randomly decide to start coding. People like Xycaleth, Didz, Razish, BobaFett and Scooper helped me learn how to code. If someone were to walk onto #JACoders right now, I would probably help them. I've written as many coding tuts as time/whatnot allows. I didn't ask for something in exchange for those tuts.

They already do this to some extent. They do it for Rancors too. They just don't do it in MP. I think you missed the point of what I was trying to say here though. I was saying that Raven could have put the saber droid animations onto the _humanoid skeleton (sound familiar? probably because Raven did the exact same thing with Alora, which worked just fine there) and made the saber droid used the _humanoid skeleton. Keeps animations from being all over the freaking place. Especially in the case of the rockettrooper, which weirdly got a separate GLA despite being the same proportions as the player. Name five people in the JKHub community who can rig player models and I'll believe you when you say that anyone can do it. I don't think anyone can either, considering there isn't a decent tutorial at all on JKHub. I don't know how modellers operate, but we coders don't just slam a few generic C++ or C tutorials on people and then claim that doing everything is "retardedly simple" or that "anyone can do it". Frankly it irritates me when people do that, but I'll stop there before I get too agitated. I believe I made this pretty clear as to why this doesn't already work.