Interview: Moviebattles II Team

I play MB2 for lightsaber duels only so if this successor thing doesn't have them I won't even consider giving it a try.

In MBII, the first and most important technique as a mandalorian you must master, is the suicide jihad attack.

I play MB2 for lightsaber duels only so if this successor thing doesn't have them I won't even consider giving it a try.

We will have them in some form. The style and such should remain the same, but the visuals and name will be different (still energy based and glowy).

Very excited to hear about your new project, @@MaceMadunusus! Can't wait to hear more and thanks for the opportunity to interview your team!

I like to hear practically anything about MB2. Thanks for your continued support of the mod and community guys!

Someone plays MB2 for the lightsaber duels? Huh. Well, I suppose that's plausible...

 

Although I must say that if MB2 has anything that resembles a shortcoming, that'd be the lightsaber duels =p

 

Great read, though I must confess that opinions contradictory to actions actually done were displayed here quite prominently. However, this was a nice insight into the heart of MB2. Keep up the good work, JKHub interviewer and MB2 team!

We've never had a really solid spec for lightsabers. Hopefully we can get that to change and make them more exciting in the successor. It is the one area in MB2 I think needs the most improvement from a gameplay perspective. The code at this point in time, after years and years of manipulation makes it such a daunting task though, that it would be better if we scrapped it and started over.

However, which ones are you specifically referencing on the opinions contradictory to actions part?

This was a really nice interview, would be good to do some more in-depth ones for the sections of MB2 as well I believe. Like for example, getting old level designers like Plasma, Norman, Immenor, Frost, and Myself to all talk about how we made things, and how we worked together kind of thing. And yes, I still have contact with Norman and Immenor, that isn't an issue at all.

.

We were happy to answer the questions you had. Maybe in the feature you might want to ask community what would they like to ask us?

As for the MB3 project, we currently had our very first alpha version tested, with 3 class archetypes. We will showcase more in upcoming developer diaries.

Just that Sxx's comment - Sxx²: Well I’m a big fan of Jedi Academy and enjoyed playing around with mods. Seeing players still playing MB2 is a huge motivator for me to try and improve things further. [as well as other similar statements] - rubbed me the wrong way since a number of changes in the mod have been done under the radar not only in spite of the playerbase's wishes but also because of these. Case in point, the removal of the much loved torso freeze (something that has been discussed heavily with little progress - primarily since the supporters of its removal seem to be unable to do anything beyond acting like parrots and repeating their, not only very biast but also incredibly flawed, arguments) as well as the less obvious removal of the base JKA "Air support" voice command and muting of the "charge" voice command.

Yes, completely. Has nothing to do with the main instigator of all the drama regarding removal of the torso freeze not attending a test session for 2 months prior to release to even voice his concerns while he was on the beta team. 60% of beta testers thought the removal was needed, which is why it was removed. We listened to the majority. It has nothing to do with the fact that torso freeze is a BUG that allows you to bypass animations to instantly kata/grapple or do other things to players without their knowledge. Several of us have already stated and even voted on your threads saying that we would be okay with torso freeze returning as a gesture, or when we remove the ability to bypass animations with it. Several of us stated it was a TEMPORARY solution that you and the community are not listening to. We removed a bug that impacted gameplay NEGATIVELY, god for bid it impacted something considered time wasting and for the lulz that has no impact on actual gameplay as well. Were such nazis! There were other bugs for the recent patch that we had to focus on, like sabers lagging when in contact with another saber in idle. We didn't have time to fix the animation-bypass but keep hug before release of the patch. I am one of the ones that support bringing torso freeze back, without insta kata and other issues and I am now having a harder and harder time supporting that out of sheer annoyance. If you want to continue saying our arguments are flawed, then good luck getting us to actually listen to you. The amount of energy we are having to expel to just try and get you guys to have some patience, and understand our side, is taking development time away from fixing the issue. Saying that the majority of the community support keeping torso freeze as it was in V0 is absolute false and your own poll on the MB2 forums followed that, where most people supported keeping torso freeze once the other bugs with it were removed.

The air support voice command served no purpose, which is why it was removed. Charge was too loud, so what? Is it really that big of a deal that you, Jango40, and others complain about an entire release for weeks causing drama everywhere over something completely minuscule? None of these things you complain about have anything to do with the core gameplay. They're things you spam to screw around and waste peoples time who are waiting in spectator after they died, and to murder their ears.

We have already addressed this issue multiple times to you and others on the MB forums, and continuing it here will not help us fix the bug. So please, lets stop this here.

Remember, we work on this for free in our free time. We aren't a paid team that works 24/7. For example, the past two weeks I have been trying to get back to school for the first time in 2 years and haven't touched a single things related to MB. We're busy, give us time.

.

Yes, completely. Has nothing to do with the main instigator of all the drama regarding removal of the torso freeze not attending a test session for 2 months prior to release to even voice his concerns while he was on the beta team. 60% of beta testers thought the removal was needed, which is why it was removed. We listened to the majority. It has nothing to do with the fact that torso freeze is a BUG that allows you to bypass animations to instantly kata/grapple or do other things to players without their knowledge. Several of us have already stated and even voted on your threads saying that we would be okay with torso freeze returning as a gesture, or when we remove the ability to bypass animations with it. Several of us stated it was a TEMPORARY solution that you and the community are not listening to. We removed a bug that impacted gameplay NEGATIVELY, god for bid it impacted something considered time wasting and for the lulz that has no impact on actual gameplay as well. Were such nazis! There were other bugs for the recent patch that we had to focus on, like sabers lagging when in contact with another saber in idle. We didn't have time to fix the animation-bypass but keep hug before release of the patch. I am one of the ones that support bringing torso freeze back, without insta kata and other issues and I am now having a harder and harder time supporting that out of sheer annoyance. If you want to continue saying our arguments are flawed, then good luck getting us to actually listen to you. The amount of energy we are having to expel to just try and get you guys to have some patience, and understand our side, is taking development time away from fixing the issue. Saying that the majority of the community support keeping torso freeze as it was in V0 is absolute false and your own poll on the MB2 forums followed that, where most people supported keeping torso freeze once the other bugs with it were removed.

 

The air support voice command served no purpose, which is why it was removed. Charge was too loud, so what? Is it really that big of a deal that you, Jango40, and others complain about an entire release for weeks causing drama everywhere over something completely minuscule? None of these things you complain about have anything to do with the core gameplay. They're things you spam to screw around and waste peoples time who are waiting in spectator after they died, and to murder their ears.

 

We have already addressed this issue multiple times to you and others on the MB forums, and continuing it here will not help us fix the bug. So please, lets stop this here.

 

Remember, we work on this for free in our free time. We aren't a paid team that works 24/7. For example, the past two weeks I have been trying to get back to school for the first time in 2 years and haven't touched a single things related to MB. We're busy, give us time.

Eh. First of all - bringing torso freeze back would take a few minutes, and blocking Secondary/Primary fire while pressing USE_HELD_ITEM would make instakata impossible. (And also take practically no time)

Second - Where the hell did any of you state that this was only a temporary solution? I have seen practically every torso freeze related thread, and never seen anyone mentioning it was a temporary solution. Link?

Third - The poll is not false. 37 people voted yes, 27 voted no (At the time it was closed). If you decide that insta kata won't be brought back, people won't suddenly want to keep torso freeze away, therefore they overflow to torso freeze w/o kata.

Fourth - Yes, I know a lot of developers want torso freeze, but Sxx (Leader) said it won't come back. How were we supposed to know it was only a temporary solution?

Fifth - If you communicated with us better, this wouldn't ever have become a problem! You can't blame us for making a drama when you are not ever clarifying what you want to do. A post in some other non-torso freeze related thread can easily slip by and go unnoticed.

Uh, and also, I think you devs should communicate better with each other too. While you say it is a temporary solution, Sxx is basically saying torso freeze is cancer and will never return. I don't know who to believe.

Eh. First of all - bringing torso freeze back would take a few minutes, and blocking Secondary/Primary fire while pressing USE_HELD_ITEM would make instakata impossible. (And also take practically no time)

.

I'd also like to point out that this was fixed in OpenJK, so the fix for it should be public. You'd have to dig through the commits to see how they did it.

I'd also like to point out that this was fixed in OpenJK, so the fix for it should be public. You'd have to dig through the commits to see how they did it.

What was fixed in OpenJK? Torso Freeze or Insta kata?

What was fixed in OpenJK? Torso Freeze or Insta kata?

Insta kata. I think torso freeze to the extent you're speaking of may be MB2-specific. USE_HELD_ITEM is blocked for sure though with +attack and +altattack

Insta kata. I think torso freeze to the extent you're speaking of may be MB2-specific. USE_HELD_ITEM is blocked for sure though with +attack and +altattack

Oh, okay then. Torso freeze is the same in basejka as it was in MB2 btw.

Lets not consume this thread with discussion on the torso freeze issue. Frankly, we have no say in it and I don't see why it's being discussed here. If you feel the need, continue the discussion in this thread, or on the MBII forums, with the community that understands and knows the repercussions.

@@Serath: Excellent idea! We were just a bit pushed for time and wanted to get this out there ASAP!

@@MaceMadunusus: Really love your mapping interview idea. I'm sure members of the community would really benefit to hear from some mapping greats. If you'd like to get that ball rolling, we'd be happy to host the interview here.

@@MaceMadunusus: Really love your mapping interview idea. I'm sure members of the community would really benefit to hear from some mapping greats. If you'd like to get that ball rolling, we'd be happy to host the interview here.

I'll see what I can do, it might be a while.

I was specifically thinking of mapping from the perspective of MB though. Which has a lot of different things to consider in comparison to traditional level design in JKA and I think it would be interesting to have a look at that as a lot of people don't know what actually goes into it in comparison to most other levels made. 

 

 

What is Moviebattles II?

 

Best JA mod addon.

Huh, they called it an addon, well thats a first. I always liked to think that MB was an unofficial mutliplayer Expansion Pack to Jedi Academy.

I'll see what I can do, it might be a while.

 

I was specifically thinking of mapping from the perspective of MB though. Which has a lot of different things to consider in comparison to traditional level design in JKA and I think it would be interesting to have a look at that as a lot of people don't know what actually goes into it in comparison to most other levels made.

 

I think this would be more appropriate to have on the official site rather than JKHub. I imagine that some mappers may be interested in the difference, but ultimately to me it seems something more catered to fans as a "behind the scenes" thing. Therefore, I think your audience would be more centered around the MB2 site. However, you might find some interested readers if you advertise here.

Hi,

 

I think this would be more appropriate to have on the official site rather than JKHub. I imagine that some mappers may be interested in the difference, but ultimately to me it seems something more catered to fans as a "behind the scenes" thing. Therefore, I think your audience would be more centered around the MB2 site. However, you might find some interested readers if you advertise here.

It isn't just about the audience. Lets say people here learning from modding, eventually want to go and make their own game or work on another game with a team as a level designer. Now that they have OpenJK's Rend2 to allow them to experience some of the more modern art practices (still outdated but better than base) with the normal maps, gloss, parallax, etc, this makes this even more possible without classes or a lot of personal time learning these. This would give them examples of things to do and consider that they never would have before. This doesn't even just apply to mappers within this community either. There have been many instances of coders venturing out into other areas as a one man team for a mobile game, and who knows, maybe what we say helps them in some degree depending on their game. 

Just about every game is different in how things are constructed, and have different sets of rules. However, having insight towards what goes into other games can be a pretty big thing in learning how to design your games or things to consider. If you know some things before hand, rather than having to figure them out down the line, it can be very beneficial. I think the community in general being able to learn from the mistakes and things we have learned from in MB can be pretty good, as they aren't all MB specific.

I love the work you've put into this. You've brought a much better system to JKA than its original authors lol.
Is there any chance you guys will add bot support of kind? I prefer to play with bots.

I love the work you've put into this. You've brought a much better system to JKA than its original authors lol.

Is there any chance you guys will add bot support of kind? I prefer to play with bots.

Bot support would be really difficult for us to add with our current level of manpower. Plus the fact that not many on the team have AI experience, and those that did are retired. 

Remember, BaseJKA's bot routing system uses waypoints. If we wanted something even remotely good enough for MB's case, it would have to be converted to a navigation mesh (I think xycaleth had prototypes of this at one point?). In addition to new entities being created in order to determine points of cover for boxes and walls, as well as the ability for bots to understand objectives and how to accurately make decisions and strategies. As well as understanding the saber system and asymmetrical class balance. We can't just have bots chose random classes fan out at the beginning and go different routes and chose cover based on that, its really lack luster and doesn't have much depth. I'm not saying its not possible because it certainly is. I also personally believe that it could add a few years onto MB2's life span by allowing people to play once the population cannot sustain itself any longer. 

The main issue is the manpower, and the level of work required that makes it something very unlikely to happen, even if all of us wanted it to happen.

Bot support would be really difficult for us to add with our current level of manpower. Plus the fact that not many on the team have AI experience, and those that did are retired. 

 

Remember, BaseJKA's bot routing system uses waypoints. If we wanted something even remotely good enough for MB's case, it would have to be converted to a navigation mesh (I think xycaleth had prototypes of this at one point?). In addition to new entities being created in order to determine points of cover for boxes and walls, as well as the ability for bots to understand objectives and how to accurately make decisions and strategies. As well as understanding the saber system and asymmetrical class balance. We can't just have bots chose random classes fan out at the beginning and go different routes and chose cover based on that, its really lack luster and doesn't have much depth. I'm not saying its not possible because it certainly is. I also personally believe that it could add a few years onto MB2's life span by allowing people to play once the population cannot sustain itself any longer. 

 

The main issue is the manpower, and the level of work required that makes it something very unlikely to happen, even if all of us wanted it to happen.

Ahaaa... I see. That sounds like a great deal of work indeed. You have an amazing mod, and I certanly hope that you get members who can help you with that one day.

I have one more question I actually tried to contact you guys earlier through your webpage, but for some reason the messages never went through. One of the coolest things you guys did for MB2 is the physics of the sabers. Would it be too much to ask you to release the saber mod for base JKA and ForceMod 3? I play FM3 a great deal - and I'm totally in love with how the sabers look in your mods Would really like to have it in FM3 RotS CE 1.5. Thanks for your reply. And keep up the good work.