*WIP* - Bespin Arena -

[lil_binger]

Thank you for your critique Moondog!  I am very glad you critiqued my map.

 

Visibility:

 

Visibility may not be perfect in some areas and there are no hints in the area you take a picture of.  I haven't added a hint in that area yet but I have had some thoughts about it but haven't got around to it yet..  Main concern is fps and with my computer fps barely dips into the 80's in the main area of the map and my graphics processing is a bit on the low side being a laptop.  The exhaust grates in the main area need some work for the most part and I plan on doing something with them before another release.  The main vis problem I have with them is the area on the right with the leaking coolant area which can be seen when in the main area.  I've mitered a lot but not everything, there's so much I could miter and optimize but if fps isn't broke I'm likely not to fix it.  I am also not a genius with hint brushes or hint optimization but I have been learning more and more using hints with this map. 

 

 

Lighting:

 

I definitly have some lighting to work on and your critique is right on there.  I keep passing by the dojo to make some light sources and some details to work on other areas.  I've been working on making some new light shaders lately but have only tested them a little bit in game and haven't placed them around the map.  Some need a little work to get to look right.  I am not the best at lighting areas but I have been learning more and more as I go making this map because I have been trying to pay a little more attention to try to light the map than I have in previous maps I have made.  I definitly have more work to do with lighting.

 

Theme / texturing etc:

 

As far as the bespin theme, ffa_bespin from JK2 is what most of the map is based on.  It is blocky and a little rough cut compared to the movie version.  It's hard to see much relevance between the two because the JK2 bespin is not even close to the movie version.  The case here is not that I am trying to make it look like the movie version but the ffa_bespin from JK2.  To bring some nostalgia factors from the original version into a redefined map.  Also the main area was originally a duel map I made years ago and had some major changes that look much better.

 

Main area duel map link on JK files:  http://jediknight3.filefront.com/file/Bespin_Traps;78052

 

The theme for the entire map will be inconsistent.  The map has areas I have made for other maps incorporated into one single map thus the name Binger's Bespin.  What I am trying to do for the ffa version was to incorporate many areas that I feel are consistent with a clan map.  Bar, council room, pad and a training area (dojo), I don't have members rooms or sleeping quaters but there are some areas near the council room I was thinking about adding some.

 

The map definitly needs some texture alignment I agree and I have already some some aligning of textures here and there but I haven't gone through the map with a comb just yet.  The 0.8 version I released has had many routes reconstructed and there are a few more that need to be redone.  The final version I should have most of the texture alignment ironed out.

 

Layout:

 

Some connections to the main area do need a redesign and there are few clips for hangups currently which I do plan on adding eventually once I finalize some paths then I can finish up clipping some hangups because nothing is final just yet and I won't be clipping some things because they may change.  There is a lot that needs to be done to help with ctf in JK2 1.02.  I've mainly been concentrating on the outsude routes with the map which still need a little work but compared to the last beta release however, they are far beyond what they were before.  There was a vis block in the back of the main area that took the player to other water elevators that just slowed down the gameplay too much.  It's much quicker getting where you want to go now.

 

 

Very good critique Moondog!  Thank you very much for your time and effort.  It is much appreciated.

[Acrobat]

I stopped using most entity lights because they grind the compiler so much.

 

I have an invisible shader that you can use to light ur map that would probably help you if you're interested.

 

Let's me make my maps at least 10 times larger although I do tend to have a lot of tunnels which this works esp well for.

[lil_binger]

Well, lately I have been making my own shaders and lights and new sky shaders with lightmaps.  Most of the shaders I was using originally were JK2 base shaders and textures and did not emit light.  I think 2 of them did and only was used in a couple areas.  The beta version I released was just the beginning of my replacing many of the light entities with shader lighting, mainly with sky shaders that emit light.  The area with the balloon and the floating platform for example is vastly different in regards to lighting.  The main area I think I have only 3 light entities now in cooperation with a new sky shader that emits light to light most of the main area that is effected with a sky light shader.  The new walls that stretch around the map have a light line and those have been changed to blue and red respectively for the side they are on and emit light now but the light texture still needs a little bit of work to look a little better.

 

The tunnels I do have in the map I have thought about replacing the textures with something different  but your response does tell me that if I do keep the texture or make a new one that I should probably add some light to the shader but the tunnels are not very long and only use a few light entities.  I will look into it however when I can get back to editing the map some more.

 

Also your idea of an invisible shader that emits light is interesting.  I will keep that in mind to use in case I need it.  I can make my own if I need one but thank you for the assistance.

[lil_binger]

Howdy fellaz!  I've been working a lot and playing other games here and there but just checking in to say hi.

 

I haven't worked much on this map in a while....just a little bit here and there, I'm looking for some more productive means to occupy my free time lately so I may pick up Binger's Bespin where I left off and try to continue with the vision I had of the map.  Not sure how long it will take to get another wip posted but I haven't given up on this map yet

 

I'll keep ya posted (Pun intended)

[IrocJeff]

Howdy fellaz!  I've been working a lot and playing other games here and there but just checking in to say hi.

 

I haven't worked much on this map in a while....just a little bit here and there, I'm looking for some more productive means to occupy my free time lately so I may pick up Binger's Bespin where I left off and try to continue with the vision I had of the map.  Not sure how long it will take to get another wip posted but I haven't given up on this map yet

 

I'll keep ya posted (Pun intended)

 

You better finish or else I helped you solved your max shader problem for nothing! 

 

I get bored with my project as well but you just gotta keep plugging away a bit at a time. 

[z3filus]

Brush paradise. I have never seen a Bespin map this large, so detailed, so full, so awesome as this project here.

(like watching that video where you concentrate on a dot then suddenly a screaming girl appears)

Please don't do this again

[lil_binger]

I've been busy lately.  Going to the gym lifting weights 5 days a week and working a full time job doing other projects on days off to earn some extra cash. I've got the last work day of the week under my belt and have 2 days off.  I've made a few major/minor changes recently that need a lot of work.  I am basically changing the layout for the connections for the middle area to the other areas of the map so smooth out transitioning from one area to another.  I really like this map so that's why I am not giving up.  I would really like to see it finished myself.  There's so much to do though.

 

I did find one problem with the JK2 version,  Entity limit does seem to significantly lower in JK2 than JK3.  Before I took a break I tried to spawn different bots into the map and I could only spwan 4 different bots and I counted up and looks like I had around 512 entities in the map.  Therefore JK2 version will not have the area with the balloon which had many many entities.  JK3 should be fine though.  And if this map is not geared mainly toward ctf not having that room will not be too significant even though I do like it and want to keep it, I still haven't worked the logistics out fully for that area (no actual purpose other than a fun room).  Maybe I might work something out to make it into a tffa map or something...

 

Hope to have something new for ya'll soon.  ty for the support

[lil_binger]

Map is a huge organized mess atm.  To re-do some of the existing paths I have rearranged a few things and moved things around and redeveloping areas.  I spent a few good hours with it over the weekend.  It may take me another weekend to bring it all back together.  There's still many things I haven't quite figured out how I want to accomplish and more ideas I'd like to incorporate.

 

Besides this map, there's another map I'd really like to complete and that's Rancor Rampage, a ctf built amusement park.  This map and 'ol Boothand and working on this map have stimulated a few design ideas for that map.  I've got some neat ideas to finish that map up.  I need to create one team's area and then create the pathways to bring it all togather.  It would be really cool to complete them and publish them together as a small pack but who knows when I'll finish the other map but I do have a new vision for it so who knows.  Once a mapper, always a mapper

[RAILBACK]

Just so you know, Bespin textures are not brown and red. They TURN brown and red from the sunset later on in the movie. Daylight textures seem to be more white, grey and blues, minus the outer doors. Hence why I chose daylight colors for my Bespin level. What I'm trying to say is, don't be limited by the default textures from someone elses ideas. Your map has that old school JK2 feel from using the old textures. I think you can do better. I do like the visual of your map though. Very cool.

[lil_binger]

I don't see myself trying to go through and reinvent the majority of all the textures in the map.  At this point I would be satisfied if I can just finish the map.  Yes I know about the movie textures I'm not trying to be ficticiously realistic.    I did to try to work some on it this past weekend but the other map I have worked on pulled me in a little bit so I didn't get much done on this one.  Hopefully some time soon, or perhaps never.  Only time will tell.

[lil_binger]

I haven't shown any progress in a long time.  Here are a few pics of current progress with my new bespin map.

 

Main area has changed a little.  There's now some minor elevation changes with the main area floor.

 

 

 

 

The two main sides of the map have been separated further from the main area to incorporate some better pathways between areas.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pad area has had a few design changes with more to come

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lots to do.....

 

Another map I have mentioned here I thought I'd post a couple more pics of the map, Rancor Rampage.

 

Middle area:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Blue Base:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Rancor Rampage came together pretty quick when I returned to map a little then I focused my attention toward Binger's Bespin.  Would be a fun ctf map if I can ever get to finish it.  We'll see how it goes

[lil_binger]

I have thought about letting the Rancor Rampage map turn into a collaborative project to anyone interested.  Some pics above in the previous post. 

 

I am also thinking about incorporating the other map in the wip section into the map for the red base.  The pyramid from the Temple of Mechanism and the corridors I have already created for that map might make a good fit as a red base.

 

Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated. 

[lil_binger]

Well, I haven't quite been able to satisfy my creative interests lately so turns out I have been messing around with this map a little bit.  I had ripped the map apart a while back to make some changes, so now I have finished some of those changes and redesigning a lot more.  The map is still an "organized mess" right now but it's starting to show some promise.  I'm not going to explain much at the moment but, there are lots of huge holes in the map and no areas are connected currently but I hope to get them all connected before too long.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I haven't compiled in ages.  I'd like to see what it looks like on the inside.  Lots left to do before I get to that point however.

[lil_binger]

Still working on the map here and there.  Making lots of progress.  So much left to do though.

[lil_binger]

Thought I'd add a couple screenies of the progress

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any suggestions or advise would be appreciated.  ty

[RAILBACK]

Sure thing bing. Uuuhhh like I said in my previous post I would love to see more daylight textures on this map versus the default sunset brown. But hey, that's up to you. As far as the map goes, looks like it has good flow. So great for spawns and bots. 

[lil_binger]

I'll try and consider some texture changes, I haven't been working on this map much lately,  I have however, have put a great deal of time lately into the temple of mecchanism map I had posted about previously.  I've had some trouble for a few days compiling the map to jump in and take a look, I spent a whole day leak testing and adjusting, A couple more days (not hours) of eliminating this and that, restructuring shader files, getting correct paths for textures (the entire map using textures only provided with the map so I will have little problems with conversion from JO to JA version.

 

Basically for the temple map, I took the original temple of mech map about a year or so ago and reworked the outside of the map.  I worked in a bunch of ideas I had with it, started creating a new room for the map (previously had only been the main area) and worked up a cool looking temple hallway, worked in some custom sounds for frogs croaking, crickets, and big cat animal sounds with some glowing eyes looking through trees adn brush.  Recently I got a new idea and just ran with it.......

 

I am working the temple map now building it all together using areas taken from other maps I have made in the past like I had done with Binger's bespin.

 

 

I Took the temple main area and cut it in half, I put in a stepped rock wall system to get far above the temple (making the temple look like it was built into the rock face (sort of).  I kept the lilly pads but insteat of circling around the temple they now go in front of the temple and will float through a cave system through the rock wall which will eventually come out to a changed main area of ffa_khomm I made for the shroom duck map pack,  I basically deleted all the detail from the khomm main area, then I took the bottom part of the duel area from the Bingstation previously released on JK2files and cut a hole in the main khomm area and placed it there to make a fighting area with a large drop beneath it.  Well, also in the main temple area, you can climb the rock wall to the top to a ritualistic dual area,  From the del area I took the men in black corridors from binger's bespin and made exits from that area and placed drop tubes you can jump into to take you to the main khomm area with the bingstation bottom duel area.   Back to the ritualistic area, I took the top part of the bingstation duel arena and placed that on top of the ritual area which workes out pretty well.

 

 

And back to the Main temple, there will be 3 lower entrances into the temple, one main entrance, and 2 entrances on the sides located in the cave ststem for the lillypads,  Inside the temple is a texture rework of the dojo from binger's bespin.  the dojo will also have accessibility into the khomm bingstation area.  I've also added some huge trees and from the very top of the rock wall theres a walkway to a tree stand / house (eventually I'd like to add another tree house or 2 and connect them.)  The main thing I wanted to do with this map is just not to have everything on one level, I wanted a tiered space with as many options as possible without compromising vis much.  The taller the area the easier to keep vis from the top from spilling into the main area.  (I still have some hinting I need to do so separate some vis here and there.  Also I am working this map to pretty much be door free without area portals, if you know how to build a map you really dont need area portals unless you have no other choice because everything you have built was never built with vis separation in mind.  (I used to think otherwise, now I build maps knowing how to construct areas so one area wont see another without area portals.

 

From the Khomm station area there are currently 3 exits to other areas., one exit kept from komm and moved around which was a good vis block for other areas of the map.  That exit goes to a duel platform in a large cave, the other way goes into a lava cave from khomm (platform and cave pretty much unaltered from khomm)  the platfor will chanve, the cave won't change much but I plan on working in some new textures into it.  ( cave has a lava river, lava drips from the ceiling and smoke sound effects and fire.  that area has 3 exits, one secret exit that would take you to an imperial looking storage area (which is about the only area which has modern looking textures, the rest of the map I am truying to make it jungle like and with rocks and fire.

 

I've also built something new reminissant of the forest house (kind of).  I took the tram system I deleted out of binger's bespin and made a very long underground cave.  I've added in some large rocks from the ceiling and floor, I've cut a hole into one rock to allow the tram to pass by without interruption and it's not cennect to another area yet but I already have an area in mind from ctf_khomm that looks kinda like the inside of a volcano with lava swirling around, I deleted all the modern stuff I made with khomm and just mainly keps the rocks and lava.  I'm going to build a rope bridge over the lava to a sacrificial pit or something.  I also brough in an old area from the outhouse map I made but deleted it due to max_points _on_widing error.  I have another version of that area somewhere that has been fixed years ago so once I find it I might bring it back into the temple map.

 

 

Today, I have finally figured out why the map wasn't loading in jk2 and I have now loaded the map and looked around basically after working for 3-4 days eliminating problems and troubleshooting.  Bascially that is the first time I have been in the ban since I put all the area together.  All that is left now is to connect the area like I originally envisiioned and build up some new stuff for the rooms.  I've been pretty excited about the map when I first worked on it a year ago but the map has come together quickly recenlty.

 

Anyway just thought I'd throw a little note here about it.  Now that I have worked out the bugs I'll try to get some screenies posted by this weekend. 

 

 

Edit; Since this map and come together quickly, I am thinking on releasing them both together if possible.  With those maps I plan on releasing them as open source with permissions to use parts of the map if anyone wants to use them for their own maps.  The caves etc might be useful or other stuff.  I am also thinking about including some of my other maps and letting them be open source as well along with this release.  Of course I will only ask for credits or to include a readme file I will try adn create for the pack which will specify permissions etc.  Maybe I'll gain a little more vigor now to finish up binger's bespin....

[RAILBACK]

Yes I have all the transdermal and Khomm levels. Interesting. I've seen and reviewed over 100+  levels since 2002. Time spent on any mod to work out all the bugs is very appealing. Sooo yea... I agree with Moondog.

[lil_binger]

Well, everything is working well now for the Temple of Mechanism.  This map is turning out really cool and quite interesting.  Most of the map is there, most everything connected and ready to go but a couple areas have not quite been adjusted.

 

I've got a stable compile today and took a few screen shots.  I'm not going to comment on each pic, I was too long winded before but now there are some images to view.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Well there ya have it.  Lots of tweaks left to do but looks promising to me.

 

Edit  (Before I posted, Pics looked much better, They are just a bit on the dark side.  It's supposed to be a dark map.....

[RAILBACK]

Is this the Temple of Mechanism level or another part of Bespin? Looks Templish. Maybe make another thread for this level?

LOVE the contrast in your first screen except for badly lit models and/or brushes (2nd screen). Would be cool if your rope walks squeaked. As much as I love water features....this engine doesnt really lend itself to realistic water. I guess lots of shader files can fix that.

[lil_binger]

There might be another thread for the temple of Mechanism.  I didn't look for it.  I was going to post the pics in that thread but just posted them in this thread.  The pictures are a bit dark, in game it looks great (althought in game it's just a little bright in spots). 

 

The majority of the work left to to is to connect the tram area with one last area, which includes some more details in the tram area for one side of the map,Tram area began as a cliff edge in khomm.  I added a couple trams from Binger's Bespin I made and deleted from the bespin map, extended the area (kinda like the tram is in forest house).  I don't have the other landing area made for the trans an no exit on that side yet but I am either thinking about placing the khomm area there or doing something different.

 

It's an old temple so I don't need to build a bunch of details so finishing of the map shouldn't be extended.,  FPS is pretty good so far but there are at least 2 or 3 places I need to add a hint or 2 or a place I need to vis block a little better. Outside is coreographed with sounds.  I do however need to go around a bit and thrwo in some disorder and chaos.  I need to break some stuff or make some stuff look broken.

 

 

Outside I need a quick way to get to tree houses from the jungle floor (either a jump or teleport.  Then I need to adjust lighting and build a small campsiite.  And lastly need to work on the waterfall shader a bit so it look s a little more natural.  There's a couple sand bars I am making for the deep areas to help navigation but outside is just abaout finished.  From the progress I have made this map more than likely will be released separatly from Binger's Bespin.  (Binger's Bespin I keep wanting to redux and redux again.  I one day I hope to finish that map.)

 

 

Anyway, more to come from The Temple of Mechanism soon

[Boothand]

Any progress om Bespin Arena?

[lil_binger]

sadly no, I stopped working on this when I got a bug to revamp the temple of mechanism.  I haven't worked on it a whole lot since then.  I've been sucked into Swtor again.  Igottwormms @ Jedi Covenant is the name and server you are most likely to find me on there.  I need to try and make some time to finish a few things up and get a couple maps finished.

[Nozyspy]

sadly no, I stopped working on this when I got a bug to revamp the temple of mechanism.  I haven't worked on it a whole lot since then.  I've been sucked into Swtor again.  Igottwormms @ Jedi Covenant is the name and server you are most likely to find me on there.  I need to try and make some time to finish a few things up and get a couple maps finished.

 

You should finish this off, its great to see JK2 still getting some love!

 

Sure thing bing. Uuuhhh like I said in my previous post I would love to see more daylight textures on this map versus the default sunset brown. But hey, that's up to you. As far as the map goes, looks like it has good flow. So great for spawns and bots. 

 

That is one of the odd things about Bespin in JK2... for all intents and purposes, Bespin architecture is white, the brownish colouration is from the sunset:

 

 

 

And yet we have come to know Bespin in the JK series for its... brown textures!

[lil_binger]

I've found a little time here and there recently to mess around with some stuff.  A little here and a little there.  Bespin arena or (Binger's Bespin) needs a good overhaul.  It's a good ways from being ready to compile again.  Large parts of the map are not connected after an overhaul and redesign before I took a break.  I have found some interest however in the temple of mechanism, working on the thermal golf course a little bit.  Someone previously talked about adding flags and they to look pretty good in radiant.

 

I always thought this map will be really liked in JK3.  the water course is perfect for speeders.  I made a test course and added just a small clip above the water (so bikes don't sink, and raced around the course full throttle, I made a test map to test varieties of terrain and what bikes could run over or jump.  It's a bit closer to being finished right now too so I would rather finish the temple map first.  But I may check in from time to time with the bespin map.

 

I also plan on releasing both maps open source with permissions to modify or use parts or in whole, as long as you call it something else, meaning if someone would like to make a version of this map, like Nozyspy's Bespin, if you think more realistic textures for the exterior of the map would be better, you would have full permission to adjust the textures to your liking, add or subtract to it, all I would ask for is some credit for the work I contributed if you were to re-release.  Convert it to a different game etc......cod4 or whatever.

 

Even when I finally do release it it won't be entirely finished, a work of art never is.....I would be absolutly interested to see if anyone takes up the interest to work with the map and transform it to their liking.  Or just use pieces of it for your own map wether it be a small little piece or a large area of the map.  Keep just the outdoors of the temple and delete the rest and start over.  You could turn the water outside into lava (which isnt such a bad idea, it might make the JK3 version more credible by having a reason why you can't pass into the water when the barrier for the bikes is activated.)  Plus in JK3 I would like to work in a glow to some shaders.  Right now I don't have any glow since JK2 with crash with the glow param.  Glow on the lava outside make the mountain look like it's exploding and lava is poring out....hmmmmaaaahhhh.

 

Anyway, I get carried away with my imagination at times.  I've heard at least a couple people talk about brown bespin textures and the realistic qualities represented in the film.  I think this open source thing would satisfy many who would like to add a touch of their own to the map.  I more than likely will not get around to readjusting all the textures or architecture too much, I am more or less updating it a little bit, the view for this map being,

 

Bespin was the most popular destination in all of JK2.  Bespin has become legendary in it's status and over a decade after it's birth, They have turned it into an arena and have redesigned the entire area to showcase the skills and agility uf the universe's best fighters in competition.  The pad area becomes the spaceport, main area the fighting arena, and the other area I was thinking may be an atrium or garden or something with a place designated for fighting which can be observed.  So, this map is intended to imitate the original, so using the original texture scheme is intentional.

 

 

And, P.S.  I will say, if someone is interested in having a look at the Bespin Arena map file and wants to make some additions or improvements, I would be willing to work on this map as a group project with others or just one other person is fine if anyone is interested.  If not I'll try to finish them eventually.